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May 28, 2006

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Comments

Gomez

Just an aside. It's easy to confuse what one wants with what is realistic.

Bravo. You have just summed up the biggest problem with the surface option and the tunnel in one fell swoop.

Scott Wood

Wouldn't the surface option create an even bigger pedestrian barrier than already exists between the waterfront and the rest of the city?

David Sucher

Scott Wood,

You might very well be right. A surface option could be even worse than what we have now.

But of course it depends on which "surface option" you choose. There are several, at least, and that is part of the problem. Is a "grade-level boulevard designed for 35MPH traffic and with lights every two blocks" the surface option? Or must the Viaduct traffic peter-out and be dispersed onto the entire downtown grid of 8 north/south avenues? No one knows of course and there has been no professional traffic engineering on the issue.

At this point, I think the fear of looking like fools will prevail and the decision-makers will simply want to make a decision and not engage in any more planning studies on a surface option they know will produce only lawsuits.

Alan Kellogg

David, consider yourself lucky. Down here we've been spending decades on getting two projects done, a new airport and a new library. In neither case has anybody acted with anything even vaguely imitating decisiveness. So be happy Seattle's city fathers are proceeding with such alacrity.

Adam Krom

David,
I guess I have known that the retrofit option is the most attractive from a highway engineering approach for a long time, if it can be done.

However, I just saw Walter Kulash give his presentation on freeway removal. Seattle would be making a mistake to keep that freeway. I am very familiar with the traffic situation and unique geography of your region. With that said, I strongly suspect that a surface boulevard will do the job. The highway doesn't actually do as much transportation "work" as people think it does compared with a surface road. Count the dozens and dozens of lanes that move traffic through downtown and you can see why an urban grid is such a robust transportation system.

During peak hours, a congested freeway might move an average of 1,300 vehicles per lane (or up to 1,900 per hour under perfect flow conditions, but those don't actually exist very often). A surface street with stop lights can move about 900 vehicles per hour per lane. Factor in alternate routes, diverted trips, annulled trips, alternate travel times, people moving downtown instead of commuting, teleworking, etc. and you can see why you can do without the expressway altogether. People use it because it is there. If it wasn't there, people would adjust and the grid would absorb the trips.

Perhaps most important, the government will save millions upon millions of dollars. The land under the viaduct, if developed, has the potential to reduce taxes or purchase a lot of services, while finally giving the city the waterfront it deserves.

My. $.02


David Sucher

Adam,

Did Kulash speak to the Seattle situation specifically?

I am speaking mostly of the politics of the situation. Lots of things are possible. Far fewer are politically possible. I do not think that the surface option is politically possible.

I also don't think it's wise as the disruption it would cause seems to me to be far in excess of its benefit.

But I don't think that the extreme surface option idea of simply disconnecting SR 99 from the grid (at Denny on the north and somewhere south of the baseball stadium) would leave us with a pleasant downtown, much less be a solution even remotely acceptable. There has to be some sort of bouldevard.

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